ADD/Laziness/or does she just not care?

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Ok really quick here's my low down (ok not quick....but more like a vent and grasp for anyone that may have the same situation).....my daughter was a premie when born almost 13 years ago....wasnt' fully developed but caught up fast (physically). That and ADD/ADHD runs in her dads side of the family.....so I feel some of this affects her....but

She has struggled with school and learning or laziness or not caring about learning or giving up all the time or????? ever since I can remember. She has an attention problem and/or laziness or both! Last night we put in another 5 HOURS of homework (the night before was 4 hours, last weekend was 6-7 hours....yes I'm keeping track....it's hard not to, because there literally is no other time that I have for ANYTHING else, but her), in which I helped with EVERY SINGLE QUESTION!!!!!!! She cannot do ANYTHING on her own (I know this sounds harsh....but it's the honest truth).....

I've tried many things and have asked for help from the school.....but it just keeps coming back to her failing. She's seeing a tutor tonight.....we spend hours and hours a night for years now, helping her stay on track.

I just finally said, Kaitlyne honey, I love you dearly and care about your education as well, but I have 2 other children who need me too, I have a husband who I only see 2 hours of the day. I also would like to help your sister study sometimes too. Your 3 year old sister needs me as well. Not to meantion I cannot get ANYTHING done (housework, cooking, anything....while helping her). If I walk away to do something......HONEST to GOD....she will call me back within 5 minutes, whining that she just can't do it or figure it out or doesn't understand or....... I'm just grasping at straws!

Her biological father is no help and we won't even go there, ok we will really quick......sorry to say this but he's a loser (I have no other word to describe him....ok I have alot, but) and he can talk a big talk and even sell an eskimo some ice.....but that doesn't help when the rubber meets the road. He is so good at lying and manipulating that I sometimes wonder....no I KNOW, that it is rubbing off on his daughter.....and he does the WHOA is me syndrom ALL THE TIME.......so get off your lazy butt, get and KEEP a job, show your other family over there and your other children as well that you can get up and go to work or better yet, show them some sort of discipline in regards to work ethic.....or responsiblity of an adult, or that you can't just sleep in all the time and have your 12 year old daughter run the flippin household over there because you are too tired...........oh and by the way.....you cannot feed our child or any child coffee every day and then buy her cappicinos on the way to school and the list goes on.....my goodness is he mental? Man!

There is nothing I can do about that situation.....but I struggle to help her and keep her here as much as possible in my household to help her understand what structure, schedule, responsiblity, work ethic.....whether we like it or not....there are things we as humans, children or adults, have to do..........whether that is homework, do the dishes, clean up, go to work.....life is not handed to anyone.

I just feel like the mean mom. But the principal tells me I'm doing everything right by pushing her and keeping on her track and sticking after her and checking on her every day and ........ I just babysit and follow her around all the time. Believe me, when I let go and try and trust her......just a little.....that's when it all goes down hill. So that is not it either, I've tried to trust her to do the things I tell her, but after like 1 day, she forgets, then she doesn't know if she has homework, or she forgot, or she lost it or she can't remember or the excuses go on and on.............

I mean I have to tell her things 8 or 9 times before she finally hears me or actually GETS up to do something about it. No she does not have a hearing problem.....her eyes are fine, she gets regular health exams as well......but what am I missing? She's not mentally handicapped......that I can see anyways.....I know that sounds bad. I think she is ADD, but cannot put her on meds because her biological father doesn't agree with this (he doesn't live with her 24/7.....plus his other children are way worse of in his household, so when my daughter goes to visit, she's the EASY one over there.....how wrong is that).

Sometimes I feel like I'm just blowing it all out of proportion....but i'm not, cuz everytime I step back and just think, heck maybe I should trust her or let her do this on her own....sometimes she amazes me, but most of the time it goes down hill.

My husband thinks maybe I should just let her fail. He thinks maybe she just needs to be let go and for me to do the best I can and if she fails, she fails or if she doesn't care then I should just do the tough love thing and say, ok I don't care either and let her fail. That is way to hard for me as a mother to do that though.

I'm grasping at anything here and I feel I'm gonna honestly have a nervous breakdown.....which I believe I had a mini one last night when I just stopped put my hands in the air and started crying and said "Kaitlyne, I'm done right now.....I cannot help you any longer tonight....I'm done" and I walked away....this was after 4 1/4 hours of already helping her (yes later on I had to come back in and help because I couldn't just let her not do her homework again)....it was 8:30 and no one else in the household had gotten any of my attention yet either......

Maybe she needs to fail.....I don't know. I mean if it's a phsycial illness then I understand, but man isn't there anyone out there in the schools or anything that can assist me? And if she "normal"....what is normal? Then yes, maybe I should let her fail, to see there are consiquences? I don't know, because then I will feel that I somehow failed her. Heck maybe my failing is my helping her out too much or always being on her.....but if I'm not.....like again lately I let go and trusted her. Last Semester we brought her grades back up to B's C's and 1 D. I thought good, now keep it up and keeping doing your best.......Come to find out a couple months later now she's failing 3 classes and the other 2 classes she's got D's in. She's failing English, Science, and History - F's.....then Math & Reading are D's. Mostly because she's missing over half her homeswork assignments and inclass assignements. I mean if she does the homework and assignments every day and fails the test.....then atleast I know she giving some effort.

Ok sorry, enough.....anyone? Help me not go nuts.

 
I will respond to this later after I get back from school My son is 10 and a somewhat similiar situation.

 
Oh thank you soooo much honey. You obviously can see where I'm coming from. We have tried soooo many different techniques. Honestly I'm ready to go get her tested, formally and have her put on meds whether her father likes it or not.

 
Thank you Kim. Yes we have taken things away.....and she has to work for them back. The Sylivan thing is too far away....although I'd love to see the area she really is being held back in. I mean seriuosly with alot of her homework, she needs to go back to about 3rd grade and start over....seriously.

Most of it is she is bored or it doesn't interest her. Not that she's not being challenged, but because it's not of INTEREST to her. I understand school is not fun, but school is not an option to me. And I also told her this stuff is not acceptable here.

It's not just school it's everyday things as well.......then I think well maybe she's depressed, but man, drugs drugs drugs, I don't want to put her on drugs. Not unless it's absolutely NEEDED, which I don't believe it is......maybe I'm wrong though.

Again, thank you Kim.

 
Thanks Kim. Those are all factors I should check on. I've been looking into buying more organic foods lately. I mean I'm not saying we are super healthy eaters, but I do prepare food by hand, most of our meals.....most are not packaged, we eat raw vegetables or steamed, and so on.....but again we do eat the snacks or packaged food sometimes or sweets sometimes.....all the pesticides on plants or hormones in meats and so forth are really messing with us people.

I have made an appointment with her doctor to rule out thyroid and other items (as I have a thyroid disease....) which could very well be a big part of her situation. I don't know, but I want to rule things out too or correct them if we have too. I will talk with her doctor too about diet/nutrition and what might help or what might make things worse for her.

Thanks a bunch.

 
Yea you know with the thyroid thing, I found out from a specialist, because my regular doctors all said it was normal....and I went to see a specialist for my hormones and that came up. The specialist said that to a doctor it looks normal but when you go further it was not (a more detailed test or version of it, showed my thryroid was working harder than it had to or something). I can't remember if I'm hypo or hyper-thryroid. I think I'm hypo.

I've also been in contact with a dietician from our clinic and she's suppose to call me back. I want to look at more natural ways to help Kaitlyne out as well. Like which foods she should definitely stay away from or which to get her to eat more of or maybe even introduce some that she isn't consuming or which vitimin or mineral may help or which might make it worse and so on. I can't wait to hear back from the dietician.

Thanks again, so much Kim for helping me to try to go the natural route. I mean actually I would love it there was some easy pill way out......but believe me, I don't want to HAVE to put her on a pill unless it's necessary and I've ruled everything else out first. Plus.....we've come this far, a few more experimenting sure the heck won't kill me/us.

Do you mind if I ask you questions or PM you if I come across or are stumped on anything I find or something?

 
I know this is going to bring on another long list of things, but I'm ready and I'm listening...

What has the school suggested you do that you've tried with little or no success?

My son, age 6, is experiencing similar difficulty and I've received tips for the past two years. Suprisingly some of them have helped. I've also read numerous books, appropriate for all ages on how to twist things about so that your child will actually begin to enjoy (as much as it is possible for a child to enjoy schoolwork) these things and do it in a much more timely manner without your help.

Here's one helpful link to start you off:

http://kidshealth.org/parent/positiv...mework_p2.html

I definitely want to share my thoughts if it will help! You're not a mean mom.

Although, without knowing more than what you've told us, perhaps trying the do it yourself approach might help. Set a timer for her to do her homework. If she doesn't know the answer to a question, tell her to skip it and move on to the next one. At the end, see what you can do to help her. By helping her, I'm assuming she has brought home the appropriate textbooks. If not, start making her bring home EVERY SINGLE book, EVERY SINGLE day. That's what my dad did to me. I had 7 large books, every day of my early high school years to bring. Ask her open-ended questions as to where she might find the answer and things that relate.

You might also consider asking her what she thinks could be done to improve the situation and/or her interest in completing the assigned tasks. And even further, discuss the importance of school for her future. Use everyday situations to corporate what she is learning. You can even involve the whole family in that.

Torture her with National Geographic, PBS and Discovery Channel programs. Take the family on historical and/or educational day trips until she can't take it anymore!!

Those are just a few suggestions. They worked for me (personally) and are beginning to work for my son.

 
Melissa....I thank you, thank you, thank you. I will surely look into that site you gave along with all the other advice, most of it I'm doing already. In regards to what has the school done that's not working or suggested:

1. Keep doing what I'm doing

2. I'm on the right track, doing the right thing

3. Keep on her

4. Keep pushing her, checking on her with assignments

5. Keep one on ones with the teachers

6. and the list goes on.....come on teachers, principal or whoever, help me out.....I obviously asked for help from all them because it was killing me to do it all alone!

She has been bringing home every single book, whether she has homework or not. And is told whether she has homework or not, she is to work on something, whether it be studying or just reading a chapter in those "oh so interesting" text books.....I also wanted to see all her returned assignments.....if I seen fit, I would make her correct her work. She was to look into extra credit work. She's got a tutor now, and we will see how that goes (every Monday and Wednesday after school for 1 hour - luckily this is free, something the school does).

Let's see, I'm trying to think of other things I thought of. Oh, I also meantioned to her if things don't improve, she will be attending summer school instead of sports this summer.....boy she didn't like that one, but I said it was not up for debate....end of discussion.

Sometimes I look and wonder if I'm being too tough though or blowing it all out of perportion.....but honestly this is not acceptable to me. School is not an option, neither is her school work. Gosh, I mean if she did all her homework and failed her tests, then at least I would know she was trying.....then we could work on tests....but the child wasn't even doing homework.

So we are working on all of this.....and I thank each and every one of you!

I am always up for suggestions and will be looking into many if not every one of everyones advice.....THANK YOU ALL!

 
Could she be reacting to the fact that you have two other children and she is craving your attention whether it be positive or negative? I don't mean this negatively toward you but some children have a very hard time in situations such as this.

 
Thank you all soo much for everyone of your suggestions, support and advice. I am so honored to have such caring, loving support from members of MUT. I am so touched by all of your words and suggestions, I'm literally about to cry!

Thank you too, for letting me know I'm not a mean Mom. I know if I didn't care or love her so much, this wouldn't have affected me so much.

Oh and the update I just got from her tonight is one class has already gone from an "F" to a "C" and another from an "F" to a "D".....so.....ya....but this does not mean it will stay there and we have a long road ahead of us. Also, the road to her attention problem or possible thyroid (again, I don't know what it is).....or depression or what's going on. So we are having a complete exam and some other tests to rule out other possibilities that may be causing alot of these symptoms that we notice.

So again, thank you from the bottom of my heart. I welcome any more suggestions or advice.....

I would say I'm speechless.....but as you can all see, I'm anything but that.....talk, talk, talk, vent, get it out, reach, ask, help, suggestions, help me....can I sell her on ebay.....SO JUST KIDDING!!!!!!

 
This is very well part of the fact too......but I don't want my other children seeing that her wanting my attention and getting it through negative ways is ok, I don't want the others thinking this is what works. I do praise her for her positives, I do kiss her, love her, hug her, snuggle her......I attend all her activities, come and have lunch with her at school periodically......she sometimes spends alone time with me......I even send her love letters periodically.....which I do with all my children (you know.....mom love notes......they love these).

You are right though....this is another part of her personality.....she is VERY DEPENDANT person and on me.....is not very independant at all.....she's a follower, a pleaser, and yes these are good or bad, depends on how she uses them.

 
Perhaps you should try looking for activities that will flower her independance. Don't ask what kind of activities those might be. I'm at a loss. What made you feel independant when you were a teen/young lady? Ask other ladies what gave them this feeling? I know one small thing my dad always did, that didn't necessarily create the feeling of indepedance but rather sort of forced it upon me was when I asked what a word meant, he would tell me to look it up. It's a simple, small thing, but it latched like crazy. When I am need of information (whether it be makeup, medical, grammatical, mathematical) I look it up instead of asking someone first. If at that point, I can't find it, I ask someone. I feel wonderful being able to fend for myself in the knowledge department, especially as a single mother and being a female alone. A way you could reinforce this a positive is to express interest in new knowledge by asking more questions, instead of just praising and explore it further with her. You could also, again, relate it to your entire family.

What subjects is she taking now? Here's one for creativity. If she ever delves into Geometry anytime soon, use your makeup as examples. Particularly eyeshadows come in all shapes and sizes, especially in the form of palettes. That's just a mini-thought on things.

Think about what subjects she is currently taking and how they relate to YOUR life. When you share YOUR days events, share them in a way she will be able to relate her schoolwork to. Eventually without you even saying anything she may catch on. It might click as you recount your days events that it sounds almost identically to what she learned in her classes.

Again, I'm just rambling, but if it helps, that's all that matters. Even if you don't use my ideas perhaps your own ideas will stem from these. I'm just trying to get the creative juices more active (I know you've already got them. As a mother it's a must!!).

(((HUGS)))

 
You know maybe that's it.....am I too mothering? Maybe she needs more independence.....but it's soooooo hard. I do let her have independence with events at school or certain activities I will allow her to do with friends. But maybe I'm too mothering.....it's so hard though. Life is tough and the world is tougher now a days and I just am afraid of her being young and naive and being taken advantage of.

You sure are getting the juices flowing. There is so much that could be adding to this....but it doesn't explain the attention deficit thing, or does it? Man.....I've got some research or thinking to do on this one.

 
Is it possible that she just has a different learning style? Some people need to read things, others need to listen, some need to learn by doing. Maybe she needs to sing out her homework? Or do her homework outside in the sunshine? The schools don't always take into account that some kids just learn things in a different manner, or be in a different environment to learn. You might be able to find a specialist that can determine the best way for her to learn.

 
You know, I have a 3 1/2 year old. She's got a short attention span on the things that she doesn't like (learning to write or draw, etc). But she'll spend hours dancing and singing and playing dress up.

She's always been a "late" sleeper. She'll go to bed at 9:30 at night and wake up at 8:30 in the morning. She takes a nap at 2:00 in the afternoon and wake up at 4:00. I've tried for 3 months to get her on an earlier schedule. It never worked. Never. Not once did she go to bed early or get up early without me having to drag her out of bed...and if I turn my back while I'm making breakfast, guess where she runs off to? Yep, back to bed.

Sometimes, when children do not get enough of what they WANT...they cannot focus on doing the things that they don't really want to. I see this in my daughter. I do not see her sitting still in class for HOURS a day...I cannot see her spending HOURS every night on homework. I have already decided to Homeschool her. She gets the attention from me that she needs...we have the flexibility to change subjects around. If she gets bored or needs a break, we can play for a while and then come back to where we left off...

I do not really believe in ADD/ADHD. I think that what we're seeing is the result of pushing kids too hard. Not you, personally, but society as a whole. We make 6 year olds sit down all day in class...give them loads of homework so that they can be successful adults. But, unhappy kids are restless/inattentive kids. That is what we are seeing. Unhappy kids. Kids were meant to play...explore. As adults we see that as a waste of time and energy. But, kids learn much more in play than they do from a book or a lecture. Kids are energy in motion and they need the space to express that.

You cannot repress energy. It has to be released in some way. Maybe you need to find the ways in which your daughter is happiest expressing her energy. If you are a SAHM, you may want to look into homeschooling. In reality, it only takes about 3-4 hours a day to do a full homeschool session. I found that would be better for Makayla than sending her off to school for 6 hours a day. But, it has to be right for you and your family. But, I would strongly suggest you look into doing that.

Good luck!!

 
i'm kind of new to mut, but i'm constantly on this sight and feel like i know everyone here, this is the second time i post a message, anyway about your problem with your daughter, my son is 12 going on 13 and its like your totally describing him! in everything! i have never gotten a good report card since kindergarden from him, he's never learned his multiplications no matter how much we practice and practice, he is lazy, but not dumb. but i have to tell him things over and over before he gets it, he knows his daily chores yet he prefers for me to tell him every day instead of automatically doing it. i also need to do each homework problem with him step by step to make sure it gets done and also like you as soon as i leave for 5 minutes he needs my help! well not until he got into 6th grade did his school finally do something about it, and got a phychiatrist to test him etc. and will now be helping him with special classes that he will have provided by the government untill hes in college! ( and is provided until he is 22 years old) maybe you can look into it at her school because junior high is only going to get harder and harder!

 
Kelly,

I'm sorry I can't help as I do not have any children.

I think the advice everyone gave here is like gold....

The only thing I can add would be from a child's perspective..

that is to say that..boy, your daughter sure sounds like me at periods in my

life growing up. I now believe I had ADD even though back then they called it Not Applying Yourself. I failed several classes b/c I couldn't understand and/or could not keep up..and I would try and it would make me even more depressed. I do know that I suffered from depression as a child and often fearfulness. Even though I have always been independent to the point of autonomy, there were times I had such separation anxiety from my mom that I would just in school run over to the window and cry until she came to get me...and believe you me sister, my mom did not have 1 tenth of the patience and love and effort that you are showing your daughter. You are just exhausted. You do need help on the level, as you put it, where the rubber meets the road. How to get it..?? Prob. your best source is the computer or phone book. Too bad about Sylvan..I also heard good things..Are you a member of a local church? Women's group? Bowling Club? Anything where you can reach out and bounce ideas off of people who are actually in your community and therefore more familiar with the resources and means to directly help you?? Can you afford/get a Reliable Babysitter to watch the whole clan for an afternoon just so you can get out and clear the cobwebs from your own head and breath some air?

Like I said, I'm sorry I'm not better help, dear...I feel for you and know that the answer is out there.

Take Care.

 
Linab5: I am going to check with the school about evalutations, thank you.

dentaldee: I received your PM and thank you.....

suzukigrrl: I'm wondering how interesting it could be to find her learning preference. I agree everyone learns differently and have tried different methods.....I think the most part is I get burnt out and that's what affects things as well.

VenusGoddess: I thank you and right now, yes I am a SAHM (5-6 years now)....but home schooling is not an option right now. We would (I hate to say this) kill each other.....honestly, when she goes to school (I know this sounds bad too).....that is my break from her or the situtuation. Gosh that sounds horrible, but I literally need breaks from it and if I was with her all day long too.....we would be at each others throats. Please don't get me wrong, I love her dearly and would do ANYTHING for her.....just the home schooling is not for us right now.....not that I haven't thought about it, I have many times. Thank you for your advice too, I am taking everyones into consideration.

makeupfreak72: Yep that's my daughter, she is lazy, but not dumb....she can learn.....just chooses not to or chooses someone else to "learn" or do her work for her.....or wants the easy way out. If something takes work.....she is just not into it. Lately though I've gotten her back on track.....but man it takes alot out of me and her. And this happens all the time.....we will get back on track and then....BAMM. So yes I do need some sort of assistance or testing or screening or whatever it may be to determine what exactly is going on so I can then work on that area and understand her strengths and her weeknesses and just to understand.....what it is that is holding her back or..........

Elisabeth: Yes I agree, she tries, then she does get more depressed. But when she succeeds she sees she can do it....but the thing is after she succeeds sometimes she thinks....ok I did it now I'm done again for a while.....that's kinda her mindset sometimes (I think). She also needs organization badly and we are constantly working on that too.

She can do great things.....but under my constant push or motivation. If I'm not pushing/motivating....she will plop in front of the t.v. (which believe me, my hubby is ready to pull the plug on the t.v. thing, literally.....) or sit around or go play or anything but what she should be doing. This goes for anything she should be doing, housework, chores, cleaning her room, helping me pick up the house or just anything I ask.....and believe me, I don't ask them alot.....but I do expect them to help out every once and a while and contribute to the household in that way.

So I have a dietician/nutritionalist calling me back on Monday to look and see if there are ways in her diet I can help (obviously there are.....she not a junk food junkie.....but she does have her share of it at times....). Then on the 27th we see our family doctor to do some tests and screenings and suggestions.........so I can't wait to see what comes up. This sounds bad but I almost hoping it's thyroid....cuz that would explain alot of her symptoms (she's gained alot of weight lately too....and man she just eats and eats and eats....she is never full.....she gets full, but then is hungry right away again?).....but then again, I'm not hoping for something to be wrong, I'm just looking for an answer that tells me why or what to do next or....it's hard to explain....plus thyroid is so fine line sometimes.

 
Well, here is something I've also noticed with a friend's son (he's 9 1/2): As soon as he says, "Mom, I can't do this. This is too hard. It doesn't make sense/etc." She walks over and either tells him the answer or step-by-step helps him out. While it's important to help kids, it's also important to let them figure out their own problems. But, this spills over into other parts of their lives. He's angry that she won't let him do what he wants to do (she's always telling him how/what to do) but yet, he gets easily frustrated because he doesn't know how to "find the answers" on his own. He's so used to having mom say, "it's this way or that way" that he cannot deal with not knowing the answer *right now*.

This may be the case with your daughter. Maybe giving her a time limit to work on her homework and then she brings the homework to you, you check it over. If it's right, give her lots of praise and a hug and maybe some kind of reward at the end of the week. If she does the work wrong, just point out what is wrong and send her back to the "think tank". My parents did this with my brother and I. They would not help us with our homework. If it was something that we genuinely did not get/understand/comprehend, then they would sit down with us and explain it to us...but they would not work out the actual homework problems, etc with us. We had a specific area that was labeled the "think tank" and that is where we did our homework. We were given 30 minutes for each assignment (now, granted this was back 20 years ago...yikes, I feel old). We were also given time to play/release stress if our homework time ran over 1 hour. But, all of our homework was to be done before dinner and bed.

I notice, with my own daughter, that I tend to jump in and fix the problems/etc that she encounters...or help her do something. I've noticed it recently and have decided that I will no longer do this. She needs to learn this stuff on her own. If she needs help, I'll encourage her, but I won't do it for her. I'll praise her when she's done, but I won't complete anything for her...whether it's drawing, writing, coloring, painting, putting little people towns together, jumping over stuff.

It's hard as a parent to draw the line...but, the worst thing that will happen to your daughter is that she'll learn some good life skills.

My thoughts are with you. I'm lucky in the sense that I don't have to deal with anything like this for a few more years. ;) /emoticons/[email protected] 2x" width="20" height="20" />

 

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