Please Do Not Believe Everything You Hear Or Read.

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Hi, this is addressed to my American sisters and concerns our British Health service.

Whilst I would never say that it is perfect, it has been pretty good to the people of these islands and to anybody who has fallen ill or had an accident whilst visiting.

There has been some terrible lies told by the Republicans and certain Democrats who are opposed to Obamas health plan.

We do not have death panels and it is not a communist plot. Yes some areas get certain drugs which others do not, but then that area will have other things that are important.

As with any government run department, there has been a complacency that has led to overspend and a reluctance to change. This is gradually improving but slowly.

The bottom line is when we are taken to hospital after an accident or sudden illness we go to the emergency room without having to bother giving a major credit card or fill in an insurance claim.

Health care free at the point of delivery is one of the greatest things a country can have to make it's population sleep easy.

Our richer citizens enjoy private health care so that they don't have to mix with the hoy paloy, they go to private hospitals with colour tvs and gourmet food, it's their money.

I am not sure ours is the best basis for your health system, the USA is a big big country so maybe it would be done on a state by state basis. Our health care is not free, we pay for it through a special National Insurance payment that gets taken off our wages when they take our tax. It just means when we go to hospital we don't have to worry about paying for it.

I think it is worth it.
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Ok rant over I am back to normal

 
I'll just be satisfied with our healthcare plan when it's the same plan the Obamas are gonna be using and leave it at that.

 
Since I don't believe everything I read I don't believe that either! Lol. I thought you left England for France in part because the taxes were too high, Jo?

 
Whilst I'll say that it's nowhere even close to perfect I really do think the NHS is one of the things the UK should be proud of. I've had plenty of experiences of NHS hospitals because of me and other members of my family and I have to say that the care has never been anything below brilliant and there are times when I don't know how we'd have coped without it.

I do think there are areas in which the NHS could be improved but what system doesn't need improving? Everything needs to go through change to become better.

And I think once we have a better leader the NHS will continue to improve (haha little dig there
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I think the idea in itself is a wonderful one. Bottom line is that a lot of people have had a lot of good or bad medical experiences and form their opinions solely on those. An intelligent design, good implementation and open minded people are required to make it work as intended.

 
Still trying to get the bread together to move to France but I would miss the dear old NHS. However the French system is I think OK.

That nasty little MEP is at this moment, having his butt kicked by the Leader of the Conservatives.

As I said, this is not perfect and some of the things the government have done is terrible. For instance, instead of the wards being run by a Matron ie top nurse, they did away with them and then put the cleaning out to contract in the commercial world. They, of course, quoted low, brought in cleaners on absolute minimum, got rid of the unions and rather than giving value for money, gave the directors and share holders huge bonuses. Result in hospital infections went through the roof. Now they are bringing back matrons under another more hi-tech name.

This government has done this slight of hand on so many different things and they are all going bad.

 
After fighting with the local government about trying to get the monster hole fixed in the street in front of my house for 9 months.... I think that I'm just not going to get sick!! Either that or die quickly in a large explosion!! Lol.

 
Ya know, Americans are fed a lot of BS about Canada's health care system.

I'm not sure who is behind the propaganda - lobbyists or politicians.

But I think they are hoping that the average American will not take the time to educate themselves about how great Canada's health care system is.

I understand that wealthy Americans, or those with great insurance, want to keep the system the way it is. But there are millions of Americans that have inadequate insurance or none at all, that are in dire need of quality health care with better access at minimal expense.

Why not have a program that low income folks can sign up for, that doesn't affect those that chose not to participate in it.

A few facts about Canada's health care:

If I don't like my family doctor, I can go to another family doctor. However, due to doctor shortages, I may not be able to find a new doctor. So I can stay with the family doctor or I can utilize walk in clinics. If I need to be referred to a specialist, either doctor can make the referral.

If I don't like the specialist that I am referred to, I can request another. Problem is, the specialist I want may not be taking on any new patients. So I'm stuck with the original specialist.

If it is an emergency, I will get surgery as soon as an operating room and surgeon are available.

If it is elective surgery, unfortunately, there is a wait. Might be a month or could be 9 months - all depends on the location of the surgery, waiting list, etc.

Prescriptions are very inexpensive - as an example $17 for my Retin A tube. Identical tube in the US is close to $110.

The doctors, nurses and technicians that have been educated in Canada all have excellent education and are constantly trying to be recruited by American medical centres.

Please feel free to ask any questions about Canada's health care system - I will do my best to answer.

I am tired of Canada's health care system being trashed by those with agendas and scare tactics.

 
Thank you so much Carolyn for clearing that up. People have made it out to seem like Canadian health system is so bad but I have seen otherwise.

 
This is a good thread. We in the United States like to portray it sometimes like we have all the answers and that other countries are not as sophisticated as us. Not at all true. On the health care front there is a lot going on now. The vested interests to be have marked a line in the sand and if misstating the health care of another country then thats what they will do.

 
I just hope that it doesn't end up like the DMV. Can you imagine going to the ER with health insurance for all bc it's already very slow?

 
Originally Posted by Karren /img/forum/go_quote.gif After fighting with the local government about trying to get the monster hole fixed in the street in front of my house for 9 months.... I think that I'm just not going to get sick!! Either that or die quickly in a large explosion!! Lol. A MICHAEL BAY EXPLOSION, THAT IS. (queue Transformers 2 explosion clips)
All in all, Americans are "fed a lot of bs" about other countries PERIOD, since the American "feeling" and "attitude" is to be patriotic. Even those teenagers who claim to support anarchy are patriotic in some way or another without realizing it, since the government does a good job of making us believe things without force-feeding them to us.

The United States government can seem very kind to some, when in reality, it believes that we are easily manipulated and does whatever it takes to make us believe that it is our friend and ally. Where this can be true, in reality, we are just tools to rally its power worldwide and to exercise its influence on the rest of the world. However, I cannot view the government in a completely negative light, because I feel it knows that this relation is symbiotic and that they must give to receive, so it tries to be good enough to us to keep 60% us smiling at least 60% of the time.

Think about what most believe are reputable news sources -- CNN, MSNBC, FOX NEWS, etc., may not be as soothsaying and right as so many people say they are. For this reason, I turn to Aljazeera, CNN World News, BBC, and Airirang. These all have the same exact problem, but they do shed some light on issues with a different perspective, since they are censored in a way different from how our American media is censored. With all of these tools, I can piece together what I PERSONALLY believe is the correct assumption on a matter. If I am still not sure, then I research the topic using as many independent sources as I can (eye-witness blogs, podcasts, C-SPAN network broadcasts -- more on this later, Current.tv -- more on this, too; and small-town newspapers). It really helps me to build my own perspective on things if I read media from numerous different sources.

NOTE on C-SPAN: These channels offer invaluable insight into the proceedings of the United States Government. They can be tedious to watch sometimes, but as some say, good things come to those who wait. These meetings are filled with humor and arguments, and dramatic relationships better than those on General Hospital unfold right before you. One can see which people band together and against whom, and what issues certain people support. There is also the occasional bum-rushing of the podium or a particular Senator or Representative...when this happens, half of the room will be laughing, and the other half will be fuming and throwing punches either because they are genuinely angry, or because they saw a fight and said, "why not?"

NOTE on Current.tv: This is Al Gore's channel. It mainly focuses on very, very progressive thinking and extremely controversial world events. It is on the very, very liberal side of the media and political spectrum. I would say it's a great alternative to traditional media outlets because they interview eyewitnesses of events from BOTH sides of the conflict or such. Even though they generally cover controversial and leftist topics, it is made sure that they report on current popular media topics just as frequently as other groups and organizations. If you don't have this channel, I suggest you GET IT NOW, or just go to Current News: News Video Clips & Current News Articles // Current and watch some of their content there.

Cool...I just made a wall of text!

 
This country has to start somewhere and I am glad to see a President that also believes we stand for the health, education and welfare of our people. To this point America has forgot the basic forms of what this country is all about. It's great to see our basics being brought to the forefront and just maybe hope being giving to the lost and desperate in need of these services. Every month I pay many hundreds of dollars into health insurances and have never used it. Instead of me feeding these insurance company ripoffs that constantly take necessary treatments away and charge more in deductibles were I to ever use it, I'm proud to see people finally standing up and at least trying to help their families and neighbors.

 
My dad has a friend who is originally from Canada. That friend's dad died in Canada waiting to receive treatment for cancer.

Then his mom got sick. They traveled to Florida to get her treatment rather than wait. Afterwards, she went back to Canada, but the friend decided to stay here (just because he liked Florida).

That's not propaganda. The Canadian healthcare system seems to work fine...until you get really sick.

 
I am thrilled to see that the people are taking a stand for what they believe in. After we have been given $24 trillion of our taxpaying money to the bankers who can't even responsibly handle their own books, I don't trust them not to mess this up, too.

 
Originally Posted by StereoXGirl /img/forum/go_quote.gif My dad has a friend who is originally from Canada. That friend's dad died in Canada waiting to receive treatment for cancer.
Then his mom got sick. They traveled to Florida to get her treatment rather than wait. Afterwards, she went back to Canada, but the friend decided to stay here (just because he liked Florida).

That's not propaganda. The Canadian healthcare system seems to work fine...until you get really sick.

That's a really, really good point. Nationalized healthcare does a great job of keeping people from getting sick with certain things that are preventable, but when it comes to certain cancers, diseases, and disorders, there is nowhere for some patients to turn.
 
Not sure how this is comparable to other countries, but this is how the Austrian NHS is, which I happen to think is fantastic. We´re a small, fairly wealthy country though. And out healthcare system has been abused by people going to the doc/hospital for the most MINOR things, just because they can and it won´t cost them anything extra besides their annual healthcare fee. Also, for years, doctors have been approving patients for weeklong treatments at health-resorts, all government paid of course, for the most ridiculous mild conditions. It used to be so easy to say you have pain here and there, and you´d get a 2week stay in a nice resorts getting massages, physical therapy etc. That cost our system lots of money and it´s one of the major reasons why our system is in debt now. If you cut out all those unnecessary expenses, our system is great I think.

No hour-long waiting times at the ER for people with urgent cases. Even with non urgent cases, you probably won´t have to sit there all day waiting for treatment.

No waiting time for emergency surgeries of course, and waiting times for elective surgeries are not bad either. I think the longest you wait for is for orthopaedic surgeries, and it´s still generally under 6 months. And they rank people in the waiting lists according to how badly they need the surgery. If a waiting list is too long for you, you can always go to a different hospital.

Austria has a great policy about organ donation. Few people actually know this here, but unless you legally sign OUT of being a possible organ donor, everybody is automatically an organ donor. That´s why we have much shorter waiting lists for organ transplants compared to countries with different policies, where you have to sign UP to be an organ donor.

Our doctors and hospitals are great, and as a med student I have seen many. Of course no healthcare system is perfect, but I can honestly say that good healthcare is available to everybody, not just the rich. Oh, and prescriptions are cheap too. And quoting statistics from only a few years ago: 99% of the Austrian population are covered by the NHS.

The wealthier people can get additional healthcare plans, that will allow them to be seen by the head of the regarding medical department during your stay at the hospital. In addition to being treated by all the regular doctors at that department. Also, you will get a room either to yourself or to share with only one other person.

 
I am really curious as to how the national healthcare will turn out here. I have heard stuff about possibly modeling it after Group Health(a health system in my area). I have no health care. A few months ago I started having pain in my arms that comes and goes, as well as other symptoms like my hands turning blue. Right now they suspect lupus, but are still trying to diagnose. I have had to pay out of pocket for my care. I have been able to use a few sliding scale programs, but if I do have lupus it's going to be hard to get private health coverage with diagnosis like that.

 
Originally Posted by StereoXGirl /img/forum/go_quote.gif My dad has a friend who is originally from Canada. That friend's dad died in Canada waiting to receive treatment for cancer.
Then his mom got sick. They traveled to Florida to get her treatment rather than wait. Afterwards, she went back to Canada, but the friend decided to stay here (just because he liked Florida).

That's not propaganda. The Canadian healthcare system seems to work fine...until you get really sick.

With all due respect, this is exactly the kind of fear mongering propaganda I referred to in my original post.

The reality is, if he died that quickly of cancer, he most likely had cancer in his body for a very long period, before he ever sought medical treatment. By then it was too late. Perhaps it is too easy to lay blame on a system rather than the patient themselves.

Having worked in a cancer centre in Ontario for a number of years, if we cannot treat a patient quickly enough in one cancer centre, we will relocate the patient to another cancer treaatent facility. In some cases, the patient will even go to the US for cancer care, and the sending province will pick up the tab.

Since we are talking about people we have never met - and the health care they recived - let's mention the American Della Reece.

Did you know that she came to Canada in 1979 for Neurosurgery? She suffered a nearly fatal brain aneursm after taping The Tonight Show.

She made a full recovery after two operations by noted neurosurgeon Dr. Charles Drake at University Hospital in London, Ontario.

Now why would she fly all the way to Canada for live saving surgery if "Canada's Healthcare system works fine - until you get really sick?"

 

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