Michael Moore: SickO

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I live in Canada, where we have public healthcare. I don't call it "free", because it's not. It depends on the province you live in, but you do have to pay a certain amount every month based on your income. In my province, most people with an average income pay about $33 every 4 months and you can go to the doctor whenever you want and it costs you nothing. To see the doctor, you can usually get a same day appt, if not that, then next day. To see a specialist, it's a longer wait (unless it's life threatening, then it's immediate). Our system isn't perfect, but I'm thankful to know if myself, or anyone in my family was to get very ill, or get in an accident, I wouldn't worry about the financial end of things as they got better. Plus, you don't put a price tag on your health, and if you're worried about something... you go get it checked. And you can always get second and third opinions.

Some people argue that with private healthcare, you get the best doctors since they get paid more. With public healthcare, doctors still make a nice amount of money, but most are in the profession to help people. No matter where you live, you're going to have good doctors, and not so good doctors, but it's up to you to pick a doctor you feel comfortable with that you feel does an ample job.

For my friends that live down there, I really hope the US gets a better system. Your level of healthcare shouldn't depend on how much money you make.

Edited to add: I seen the debate on Oprah. It really struck me when the doctor said she had to deny a man a life saving surgery since he couldn't afford it and she was commended for saving her company thousands and thousands of dollars. Is it more about saving lives or making money?

 
Kelly...everything you said if DEAD ON!! You are a saint for what you do. My little sister is a CNA and she works sooooo hard for next to nothing.

There has to be a better way.

 
Originally Posted by CellyCell /img/forum/go_quote.gif How much are taken out of a check for taxes?Me - about $30/$40 per check.

How much for visits to the doctor?

Hundreds/Thousands depends on what happens, what is given.

Personally, I rather have those what, $5 or more (obviously it's more depending on how much you make, but I don't make much) being taken out of my check if that means I get free healthcare. Then so be it. I rather pay that extra $5 bucks than oppose to $300 if I didn't.

Saying an extra $5 opposed to $300 is misleading imo. I have gone to Dr.'s walk-in clinics twice while being in-between insurance, and both times were about $100 (one of those times I got a tetanus shot because my dog accidentally bit me). Assuming $5 is taken out of each paycheck and you get paid twice a month, that would be $120 taken out every year for "free" healthcare.
I just don't think free universal healthcare is the answer, imo.

 
When I had insurance through my job it was $30-$40 out per check....but it was also a $40 copay for visits. It was also out of pocket for prescriptions. It might also be more for procedures that aren't fully covered. Don't even get me started on how Birth Control isn't covered but Viagra is.

 
Originally Posted by BeneBaby /img/forum/go_quote.gif When I had insurance through my job it was $30-$40 out per check....but it was also a $40 copay for visits. It was also out of pocket for prescriptions. It might also be more for procedures that aren't fully covered. Don't even get me started on how Birth Control isn't covered but Viagra is. Amen, sister on the Viagra.
 
First, on Michael Moore--he's over the top no doubt, but I really believe what he does is very American and not a lot different than what a lot of people before him have done. He generates discussion about things Americans don't generally like to discuss. I'm not saying I agree with everything he says, but I like that it generates discourse.

As for healthcare in this country it is terrible. Insurance companies and drug companies make big bucks on it and everybody else suffers. I find it really funny when people argue against socialized medicine by saying "you don't want a government bureacrat controlling your healthcare." Well for most of us we have a bureaucrat from an HMO making these decisions for us anyway. My friend almost had to pay the full cost of her daughter's birth because she didn't think to call the insurance company when she went into labor and ask if it was OK to deliver. This country guarantees people the rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. I don't see how that responsibility is being met when such a large and growing segment of our population has to do without adequate healthcare.

 
Ugh, disgusting.

I feel you, Kelly. I dunno how you're managing to stay sane, haha.

Maybe I am throwing around the word "free" loosely cuz obviously not many things here are - and at times it's hard to get my point across. But please, I rather hand down those $120 yearly if it means me, everyone else in my family and others who can't afford it to get to go to the doctors without worrying how much everything will cost per visit (and I'm talking about common things like colds, check-ups, certain medications etc). $120 a year versus $300 per visit... hell. And that $120 will guarantee that everyone else in the states is insured - every itty bitty person. Shouldn't everyone be allowed to have some form insurance no matter their income? "Free" health care will greatly help those who don't have a penny to their name. Like they say, it's being treated as luxury...

I shouldn't be writing when I'm on a buzz, oi... my heads spinning.

 
honnestly, im canadian, and we have "free" healthcare depending on where you are it's "Freeer" and i have family in ny who have been all kinds of sick and my aunt is a nurse...i would take ours over yours any day. when its important, you may have to wait longer, and yes some people cant wait and they either die (unfortunatly, im not trying to sound callus) or they dont. Just like people in the states die, or they dont. Its rediculus that one doesnt go see soemone and their condition worsens because they dont want to rack up the bills. What exactally is your country doing for you in this case? NOTHING. I'm not saying that our way is the best way, because everyone gets treated...including alcoholics who drink their way to liver disease and still get treated. but i know at least that when i got rushed to the hospital when i thought i was having a heart attack, the thought of the bills didnt finish me off. And the fortunate, can pay for faster and better doctors vs. the us where the fortunate get doctors, period. At least there is the other option. I may be 100% wrong, and i expect all kinds of canada bashing b.c there allready was, but i dont take offence, im just saying...maybe there may be a solution in half-half medicare. and i dont remember who said it, but doctors here, are GOOD doctors, they are such because they WANT to be, they want to help people. Like nurses everywhere, anyone in their right mind who think nurses are in it for the money are dead wrong. Its all about the nurses(sorry rant).

 
Oh man, this is getting worse and worse. Kelly, ITA with every single word you said. I honestly don´t wanna be in your shoes in your job as a hospice nurse!

Doctors here are not getting paid much either (well, less than in the US, that´s for sure), but since our health system is governement controlled they (and the nurses) don´t have to worry about the costs of treating someone. Well yes, the only thing they have to "worry" about is prescribing some generics rather than the brand name medication, but not even in all the cases.

If it´s proven that the more expensive med is better, then the patients gets it. If patients can´t afford to get their prescriptions filled, the government pays for it all. Of course we´re a small country and don´t have a lot of the expenses the US has (um...war, that´s all I´m saying), and yes our health system is in debt...but for some reason we still make it work.

No solution is perfect per se, but the people´s well being should always be top priority. Anything else is not acceptable IMO!!!

 
ours is getting worse... I guess I dont really know much about it but i do know that it sounds like the medical system in most countries is exploiting everyone - nurses being overworked and not paid enough, patients treated like they should be grateful customers... it's not a world I'd like to bring a child into
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Originally Posted by CellyCell /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ugh, disgusting.I feel you, Kelly. I dunno how you're managing to stay sane, haha.

Maybe I am throwing around the word "free" loosely cuz obviously not many things here are - and at times it's hard to get my point across. But please, I rather hand down those $120 yearly if it means me, everyone else in my family and others who can't afford it to get to go to the doctors without worrying how much everything will cost per visit (and I'm talking about common things like colds, check-ups, certain medications etc). $120 a year versus $300 per visit... hell. And that $120 will guarantee that everyone else in the states is insured - every itty bitty person. Shouldn't everyone be allowed to have some form insurance no matter their income? "Free" health care will greatly help those who don't have a penny to their name. Like they say, it's being treated as luxury...

I shouldn't be writing when I'm on a buzz, oi... my heads spinning.

I've gone years without having to go to the doctor. And, even when I did (and was between insurance), it was cheaper than the $120 that you would be paying a year. I'm just saying...
I could go on and on, but I'm not going to.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Like I said before, free univeral healthcare is not the answer, IMO.

 
I don't know... I don't have insurance right now, but I can afford regular doctor's visits, prescriptions, etc.

Now, I can't really afford a 10k hospital stay like Mander's posted about but I can afford the basics.

My cousin, and a friend of my parents both told me about a type of coverage through blue cross/blue shield that is 90-some dollars a month. It is like a major medical coverage where you have to pay for all doctor's visits, prescriptions etc., but if you are hospitalized or emergency room visits are all covered. Having a baby is covered, and I think those doctor's appointments. My cousin even had a problem with her eye getting majorly infected and that was even covered. 90 some dollars a month. With all the makeup we buy, I think we could all afford this.

Now, if your are the type of person who has a lot of doctor's visits a year or need many prescriptions... this is not really for you... although I still think it is worth it, just for the emergeny room visits/ hospital stays. I think my cousin said Dr.'s visits cost a little less with a copay, but I'm not sure what it was. According to her and my parent's friends...it is great insurance for the cost.

For me it is perfect because I don't have many regular visits a year (except checkup).. I don't get sick a lot, but I am worried to have no insurance for hospital stays or emergency room visits. Anyways, I am in the process of getting enrolled with this insurance.

It might be worth looking for plans like this where y'all live. Maybe you'll find something close to it or better.

Oh on a side note, maybe I'm lucky but I'm on Nuva Ring, and my bc costs 60 dollars a month without insurance... When I go to the gyno, she knows this and stocks me up for almost a whole year. She is awesome.

 
Originally Posted by StereoXGirl /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've gone years without having to go to the doctor. And, even when I did (and was between insurance), it was cheaper than the $120 that you would be paying a year. I'm just saying...
I could go on and on, but I'm not going to.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Like I said before, free univeral healthcare is not the answer, IMO.

Perhaps it was cheaper because of location?
I asked my mom about this and said if there were affordable insurance for me, of course she'll have it. Me and my dad are the only ones not insured.

My middle sister is the only one covered thru the state because of her epilepsy.

 
I'm in Canada, so we have the "free" health care where we pay a certain amount every 4 months. I rarely go to the doctor, in fact, I probably haven't been in over a year, but I don't look at this as "wasting my money".

To me it's the "what if" (I don't like living my life by 'what if's' but this is kind of important!
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). I like the security of knowing that if me, or anyone I cared about had been in an accident, or needed major surgery we wouldn't have to take out a loan, or sell our house just to get better, or in a worse case scenerio, save a life.

 
Im gonna say a situation that pretty much sums up american health care for the non wealthy people.

When I woke up at 3 am in excruitiating pain from what I didn't know then was kidney stones, I called my mom crying who was at work. she came home and woke my dad to take me to the doctors. Mind you I have never seen such pain, and I had no idea why..felt like something was terribly wrong. Well when we got there they not only made me wait till like 7 am just to do a scan..the bill was like 300..for telling me that I had a stone and that it might pass on its own?? Wtf.

Thats not even the point. The point that sums it up is, my dad was angry at me for going to the doctor. He kept talking negatively to me saying that I didnt have to go and that I love wasting his money. Wtf?? He was mad at me for it..for being extremely in pain..all because the healthcare is so rediculously high. If we were in canada or anywhere else with 'free' healthcare he wouldnt have been upset with me. They didn't do shit for me, either. It cost hundreds for my dad even with insurance (not sure how it all works but not everything is covered)

Basically dad got pissed at me for me having to go to the doctors. great health care huh?

Oh and i've had to get a few more scans done since then, along with a 24 urine collection to see if my diet was doing it to me. That brought it up to about a thousand for all the bills that really didnt do anything for me.

 
You got me worrying if I have my Kidney stones still, thanks Mins...

...bah, I just want damn coverage.

 
Originally Posted by MindySue /img/forum/go_quote.gif Im gonna say a situation that pretty much sums up american health care for the non wealthy people.
When I woke up at 3 am in excruitiating pain from what I didn't know then was kidney stones, I called my mom crying who was at work. she came home and woke my dad to take me to the doctors. Mind you I have never seen such pain, and I had no idea why..felt like something was terribly wrong. Well when we got there they not only made me wait till like 7 am just to do a scan..the bill was like 300..for telling me that I had a stone and that it might pass on its own?? Wtf.

Thats not even the point. The point that sums it up is, my dad was angry at me for going to the doctor. He kept talking negatively to me saying that I didnt have to go and that I love wasting his money. Wtf?? He was mad at me for it..for being extremely in pain..all because the healthcare is so rediculously high. If we were in canada or anywhere else with 'free' healthcare he wouldnt have been upset with me. They didn't do shit for me, either. It cost hundreds for my dad even with insurance (not sure how it all works but not everything is covered)

Basically dad got pissed at me for me having to go to the doctors. great health care huh?

Oh and i've had to get a few more scans done since then, along with a 24 urine collection to see if my diet was doing it to me. That brought it up to about a thousand for all the bills that really didnt do anything for me.

I love you, Mindy, and I'm sorry that happened to you.
But I don't think your situation "pretty much sums up american health care for the non wealthy people."

Also, with free healthcare, you probably wouldn't have been able to see a doctor until the stones had passed anyway.

 
Well I think it does, maybe not to everyone..but the general gist is people hate to pay for their healthcare bills. Nobody likes that.

 
Originally Posted by MindySue /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well I think it does, maybe not to everyone..but the general gist is people hate to pay for their healthcare bills. Nobody likes that. Ok, I can agree to that! lol.
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